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darin 03-13-07 02:14 AM

I have had bad beat after bad beat. I finally just won. Know how? I pulled all my money out of full tilt. I have played many sites, and this has been, by FAR, the worst.


bennyson2007 03-23-07 05:15 AM

i found this site just looking for answers, and after reading some of the comments and actually having 90% of that stuff happening to me.. its funny. ive spent 125 dollars american so prolly close too 200 dollars canadian on party poker. and ive lost it all, but to add to that. my very first hand i was delt pocket 10s on full tilt. i hit 4 of a kind on the flop. sum other dude had the same situation happen to him. how is that not rigged? haha, and since ive turned 19 ive gone to my local casino 2 times with less then 300 dollars on me and walked out with 700 and 500 more in my pocket... its just not worth it, but it seems so crazy. i buy in for 20 bucks, within a couple hours im up 2 100 bucks, within 2 hands im back down to 20 bucks.. king high flush on the flop. guy goes all in for 40 bucks, i call. blank on the turn, diamond on the river, buddy has the ace. i flop a straight with QJ board was 8 9 10, one guy all in with j 7 another guy all in with ace k. guess what the next to cards were.. Q J.. oh and this was at a 10 seated table, no seats open... now how fishy is that? what are the odds.. somebody get me a calculator.

slimthuggahhh 03-30-07 02:35 PM

it's all about your attitude
this is the first thread where every post I've read is wrong... guys you're only looking at one side of it. Of course bad beats and suckouts happen everywhere, live and online... it's part of the game. I think you have to be pessimistic to believe that sites are rigged, because they're not. You have to lose before you get good enough to be a winner and make fewer mistakes.... and online poker should never be outlawed, that's a horrible statement... that's like wishing someone to get in a car accident, cmon guys.

chelsearule1 04-03-07 09:43 PM

i thought fulltilt was the best site i played but last two months about 100 bad beats and i put no bad beats on anyone,i had 10 10 flop was 10,a,8 he went allin i called he had aj turn card jack river ace sick,then 24 hourslater flop set of 10s agaisnt king high and hit runner runner straight both real money then i play fake money aces vs kings vs queens and donk flops a queen every time this site gives me bad beats real or fake money dont worry i give up on this site only pokerstars now joke site fulltilt only gd thing about it is phil ivey plays there and u can chat to him.

Giuliozero 05-03-07 04:20 PM

...and I thought they were just impressions!
apart from the usual bad beats (AA loses its statistical power repeteadly on this site) I found much of what is written here absolutely correct and very much applyable to my situation on full tilt poker.
At first I thought I was just reacting as a bad loser to bad beats but then I just got curious and started studying what was going on...and fortunately I got suspicious BEFORE I put my money on the site!
If you play in real tounaments (real people sitting in front of you) just compare what happens on the site to what happens in real life.
i've seen more more quads on the site in one week than in all my life in real poker!
but the best was this:

4 people left in a tournament, 2 are playing the hand:
seat one raises
seat two re-raises
seat one calls

flop is 44J

seat one goes all in
seat two calls

so they show the cards and seat one proudly shows pocket 4s! alright: quads! way to go!
and seat two only has pocket 10s!
now seat one has 99.90% of winning and seat two has 0.10%! bye bye seat two!

but not so fast...turn card: a 10!
but hey, not that bad, seat one...you still have 97.73% chance of winning so relax!
unless the river card is...
(you can guess it..)
with a 2.27% of being there: another 10!

wow: that was unreal. but it's not over yet...
NEXT HAND (3 players left) goes as follows:

ME: QQ, I raise..bad move, the guy on seat two calls, seat three folds.
flop is Q 10 8

no problem for me: I go all in! worst move ever.

seat two shows: J 3 (how can you call a raise with that?)
well, turns out to be the best call ever since, despite my 95% percent of winning,

turn card is a nice ace,
river card is a nice K.

ok..straight. happens, (not too often but it happens)
bye bye to me.

THE VERY NEXT HAND: 2 players left

seat two: A J
seat three: Q K

flop is: K A Q

everybody all in.

now, who would YOU bet your money on hitting a FULL HOUSE?
if your answer was seat three, well I don't know how to tell you this but...you lost everything.

turn: J
river: A

end of the tourney. seat two wins.
and the things written on the previous posts about the "hot seat" start to make sense to me.

As Ah losing PREFLOP to 5c 5s
with a board with four clubs sitting there. science fiction? nope: I learned it can happen. On full tilt poker.

KK vs 99?
be sure a nine is coming out. OFTEN.
On full tilt poker.

(or go see for youself...)

fulltiltoffersaction 05-04-07 02:45 PM

This is from the FTP forums about it being rigged it's not so many bad players in USA
"I've said this a 100 times and maybe more to people Full tilt offers action in live poker the % of hitting a pair is %16 on the flop in FTP the chance is almost doubled maybe 3x that the site provides action that can lead 2 two things, Shakey Players and Gimps being busted.

I've tilted so bad so many times because of the players on this site and yet another pay cheque down the drain.

If Online poker is a clue to do something with your life it better be writing the software to realise there's 52 cards not 100.

Almost an ace always hits the board in every headsup situation and AK vs AJ - K 10 Q will always hit it's happened to me about a 1000 times and im furious ive given up on poker and players like jamie gold make me glad that he beat all the so "called" pros its a crap game that is all luck based.

fulltiltoffersaction 05-04-07 02:59 PM

Full tilt is an Action Giver
It's awesome i always represent middle pair or Highest card on the board but i play with hands like 4-5 4/10 / j/6 it pays off too play these on FTP they are really good against AK / AA.

ive given so many bad beats to people ive gone all in with $350 in a 10/20$ game and CHris ferguson sat in watched me hit a set with 4/9 - 4 4 a [ i raised all in guy called with just a lazy ace ] i beat him and he said ftp was rigged its not the style i use is playing with cards people dont use and if alot of people fold u can bet that they have one of the cards you need too bad beat them.

oh yeh i work for ftp as well i sit in on the ring games and play people its fun but the job is hard and i only work in china.

fulltiltoffersaction 05-04-07 03:01 PM

Full tilt is moving back to the united states by next year. Anyways i put a bad beat on a friend tonight he said hey im unlucky i said ya and showed him my 4/10 he had Cowboys to my Full house :(

bobolikesmilk 05-06-07 02:20 PM

Ever since the U.S. government banned banks and so forth from allowing money to be transferred to online casinos and poker sites my ability to win anything has became almost none existent. I went from around a 60% win rate before Jan. 2007 to barely 20%. I made my first deposit of $50 back in May 2006 and played on the winnings until this year. I've since dropped almost $500 and am down to $38. I'm not that aggressive of a player and normally only play cards above 10's or pairs. So, in a way I am a kind of tight player. Sad thing is, in reality this strategy works well for me but here lately on full tilt I’m better off doing the opposite. I have to bluff a lot now on here just to win some chips to keep me afloat between the extremely long run of crappy cards I get. I hate that crap. I love playing poker live with real people but I live in Indianapolis and the casino's are some distance away along with the state cracking down on poker clubs and home games. So I have to play online to fill my desires. To top things off I'm on a Mac so Full Tilt is the only place I can go to play for money. Poker Room used to be Mac compatible but not anymore. Poker Room is worse then Full Tilt though. I'm still wondering how a straight beat my full house and another time my quad 7's were beat by a full house. After that one I pulled and headed for the door never to return. Anyway, looks like I’m stuck in an abusive relationship with Full Tilt. Funny things I just won a $1.25 sit & go by playing crappy cards. lol oh well...that's poker. Isn't it? They didn't pick the name Full Tilt for nothing! Should be called Bad Bet Poker!

Derek81 06-04-07 02:24 AM

Ive played on this website for a long time,It is not rigged,Your all just a bunch of Weak lil crybabies,waa ,waa I went all in on my A-A And it lost to 3 deuces waa waa its rigged!! lmao

niceGuy 06-07-07 02:35 AM

after reading all the comments here... I found alot of people sharing similar experiences. before making any comments, i want to share some info about myself. i am a phd stduent studying computer science and mathematics in one of top ten graduate school in US. i have played online poker for almost 2 years. i usually play 8-10 tables at the same time. the stakes i regularly played are: 1/2,2/4,3/6,5/10/,10/20 ring games as well as SNG and tournaments. i knew the importance of bankroll management and bad run etc. i am not trying to be cocky when i say i am a phd math student. my point is when i play multiple-tables, i found patterns. to make things short, say i saw people with 4,4 hit a set on one table, i immediately knew if i got 4,4 on aother table within next minute or so, i am guaranteed to hit a set (at least it's a winnig hand)too etc. i am not devoting time to describe all the patterns i found. i am not even trying to convince other people. i am plainly sharing some of my conclusions with people who want to listen. as some of you know, a couple of grad students cracked the random generator on planetpoker or soemthing back then, they know every single one's hand as well as what's coming out next on the flop. there're always people telling me about statistical variance etc (including alot of my friends), but i found out those words usually come out of people who have little understanding of mathematics and programming. maybe those words make one sounds really cool??(sorry being sarcastic). i am absolutely convinced the hands are rigged online based on teh pattern i found. i can't even count how many hands have i played over the 2 yrs span. think about it, 8-10 tables at the same time, on average 4 hrs a day, 365x2 days... people might ask: ' if u are so smart, knowing about the pattern, how can you not making any money?' let me tell you, the turn and river are dynamic, if you push all in with your best hands before turn, they can easily **** you up on turn and river. i tried to play smart, if i knew a hand is setup for me, even if i have the best hand on flop, but i still have to fold it if other push me all in b/c they will hit runner runner... if this situation happen alot, you lose alot of money folding those hands. to make it easy to understand, say i got AA preflop, i reraise someone to 16 times BB, and they called with 4,5 suited, and upon seeing the flop, i immediately knew i am dead, then what should i do? if im conscious and not on tilt, i have to fold, see you lost 16 times BB during this process. they keep the bad beat often enough, so that you can't really make any money... have u wondered who won the big tournament on pokerstar sunday millions etc? they are fake players, bots deployed by their own site to gain profit...have u seen those player playing alot on the site? ask yourself. enuf said, i am shocked at alot of people are ignorant enough to play online, especially people with no knowledge defending the site all the time using "big words" statistical variance...etc... send me an email at [email]mountain_dew_dew@hotmail.com[/email] if you want to discuss about this... the only reason i would ever want to waste my time to write this post is for the good of others...

nathanthomp 07-02-07 08:17 PM

this site is such fuckin bullshit i swear to god.. every time a play a tourny i put, money in as favoret and get sucked off..dont play hear bots all ocer the fuckin site ripin u off.....i swear i put money in as 90 persent favorite 87 times and lost 69 times..fuckin cockscukers cheetin and shit dont play on this godddamn bs site.. ft can blow my ass

JarJar 07-08-07 06:15 PM

For The Past 4 Days I've Logged Way Too Many Hours On Here, And Here Is Why You Can Consider Digitally Generated Poker Cards "rigged". It's Not Like Some Little Guy Is Picking Cards Trying To Screw You Over ... It's How High The Software Has Set The Probabilities For Certain On-board Card Situations. Think About It ... How Many Times Have You Seen 3 To 5 Same Suites On The Board, 3 To 4 Ordered Cards, Or On-board Pairs? The Probabilities For These Situations Have Been Jacked Up Unrealistically High To Promote The Uncommon Hands Of Flushes, Straights, And Full-houses. That Simple. That's Why Everyone's Pocket Aces Are Getting Bad Beaten On The Flop From Cheap Garbage Cards Catching Flushes And Straights. Never Play For Real Money Except With Real, Physical Cards Folks.

Karrotsticks 07-23-07 11:02 PM

After reading a majority of the posts flaming online poker sites for allegedly rigging the site i believe its safe to say that many of you lack any kind of common sense. Look at the amount of money poker sites make already (tourney buy ins, pot dividends, etc.) and think to yourselves why they would have any kind of motive to rig the cards. This goes especially for the bumbling idiots posting comments about how they think the play money tables at FTP are rigged. I can't believe the amount of ignorance in this thread. Have any of you ever taken into consideration that you are taking so many bad beats because you are seeing so many more hands per hour than you normally would in any live game. Part of me even wants to say that the reason for all of this is the imbeciles that don't realize how much quicker you are making decisions than you are in live games. Some of you just need to stop blaming your donk play on rigged cards because it has happened to me before where my quads have been beat by a straight flush in a live game. Bad beats are a HUGE aspect of poker and so if you can't deal with them you might as well know now that you're always going to be a terrible player.

un666 07-27-07 12:44 PM

1. A-a Never Wins
2. Gutshot And Runner Runner Always Hits
3. Straight Flushes And Quads And Royal Flushes Galore
4.will Be Up A Couple Hundred Play The Exact Same Way And Lose Everything
5 6-3 And 7-2 Beat K-k And Q-q All The Time.

Bottom Line The Worst Hand Always Wins On This Site. Unless Playing Good Starting Hands Like I Do Is The Wrong Way To Play Poker. Hand Like A-a K-k Q-q J-j A-k A-q These Are What I See Lose All The Time On This Garbage Site. Ive Played Thousands Of Hands Online And Thousands Of Hands In Casino's Completly Different.

logicninja 07-28-07 11:06 AM

To all you aspiring poker players i feel your pain , we were all hypnotized by full tilt marketing sceams , dreams of making it big the simple glimpse of hope that if you play well and solid enough you will make it ,like all these pros ,well my friends you never had a chance all this time you thought you were being treated fair you were getting stuffed like a turkey , ive seen my share of aces cracked , people calling reraises with crap like q 9
and destroying your kk or aces it is not coincidence, mathematicaly speaking you can lose with kings or aces 1 out of 10 or 1 out of 9 times , in full tilt you will lose with aces or kings at least 7 out of 10 times now matematically that is impossible in a real game , how could the best read before the turn punish you and on the turn you are drawing dead! bad luck
it can happen . But when you get unlucky everyday like me by playing the best hand making the best read and most of the time making the best decision , it is not coincidence but at that point i still was naive enough to think i might have been too loose now yesterday was the pinaccle of my frustration with this site i get aces in early position i raise before the flop 3 times the big blind, i get one caller flop comes 4 ,k,q im always nerveous with aces because of my past experience so i go all in on the flop i dont wanna slow play my opponent he calls with a nothing but a pair of qs he had qj , i tought that this guy must have been drunk because his call made no sence with k on the board so i am clearly at least 10 to 1 at this point river comes with j my opponent had q s and jacks , now i lost half my bank i recomposed my self and continued playing intrigued by this guy who i tought the way he was playing shoud go broke very soon , not even 5 minutes after this hand i get aces i raise twice the big blind another guy reraises 3 times my raise the drunk guy that felted me before calls flop comes 495, i go all in again the guy that raised me folded and my drunken friend called instantly with a pair of 9s he is holding q9 i have aces turn comes k ,river is a 9. Catch my drift lose with aces once in a night possible ,lose twice with aces in less then 5 minutes there is definetly something going on , i beleive that player or robot what ever this ass%*%*& was he knew what flop was going to come he knew i had aces he knew that flop was going to be in his favor , im not sure if all on line poker is rigged i play regularly on pokerroom i have noticed that alote of my hands that i would fold would end up on the flop strange ? , but i have been winning regularly at pokerroom and at my home games also played in casinos i noticed at least 90 % less suck outs on the river , i heard some bad things about pokerstars one of my friends friend works at pokerstars in marketing she claimes pokerstars boost flops and player hands to create faster action and more dramatic action means more rake money, the bigger the pot the bigger the rake , like when ever you have kowboys someone will wake up with aces that creates alote of big pots .
in conclusion all you poker junkies lucky enough to live near a casino stop asking your self why your losing on line and go play a real live game even though the casino rake is very high you will be amazed at how well you do in a real game instead of on line , in my city montreal canada there is no poker at the casino so i will have to settle with underground games . stop playing at full tilt hope these fuckers go bankrupt and that someone can come up with legal proof that these games are rigged. Oh and a message to karrotsticks you probably work for full tilt , but if you dont i would like to know your name at full tilt i would play you heads up for about a 1000 $ see who is a donk if you are not working for these fuckers than you are probably too green to understand what im talking about and will need at least a good 1 or two years of playing poker at full tilt to know what you are talking about , there is no law for online poker how can it be regulated it is not controled by the governement the head offices ar all in costa rica or europe and you think that rake money is enough why settle for a million a day when you can make 10 millions a day , i am successful in poker but not at full tilt why ???? go play a cash game for 3 hours real money now not play money you ll see good players go broke there .

Defiantly 07-28-07 02:10 PM

After reading these posts--WHILE actually playing full tilt poker--I've decided to immediately pull out all my money. I've lost about 90 dollars so far, ALL on bad beats. While reading these posts, here is the situation. I'm on my blind with K7 hearts. Played two has 82 hearts, and playing three has Ah/5c. The flop is three hearts. I've got a flush, player two has a flush, and player three has a pair of fives. Everyoen goes all in. Of course, already having my bad experiences with bad beats I'm assuming another heart is going to come out and give player three his Ace high flush. Afterall, how many people would take such a huge risk on a pair of fives and a flush draw? But, no. Another heart would be too simple for full tilt. The board is something like 5h/Qh/4h. The turn is a queen. No big deal, right? That is, until the river pops up with another queen. Please, someone tell me the odds of hitting runner runner queens? Of course, I can never have an AQ without someone else having an AK. It is an impossible task. It has nothing to do with the quality of players. I accept that bad beats happen, but not 95% of the time. Real people, with their money on the line, don't make such reckless, stupid moves. I've never been beat by J3 so many times in a row. Anyway, I'm done with that BS site. ^_^ I'm free!!!

lloydy84 07-29-07 05:02 PM

I have never played full tilt, but was thinking about it.. thans for pursuading me not to. I have played party poker for over a year and have found out that indeed it i cheating me. Now I dont men the site is making money from me.. et etc like some people think, BUT i know it is cheating ME.

Now there are some people who read these posts and say.. yeah what a load of rubbish etc etc. Well listen to what I have to say. I have tracked 9 months of hands. Thats a lot of hands. In fact thats over 42000.

By using poker software I have gathered every all-in situation I have been in and calculated the odds that I would win. On AVERAGE over my many hands, I was 58% favourite. I actually only won 48% Now I know to some people this wont sound alot but actually I play sit and gos, and have worked out that this has cost me nearly $3000. So instead of me losing $1200 as I have done, I should in fact be in profit by $1800.

Now next, looking at my hands, I am unlucky, but not by much. Althought I recieved Q,6 nearly THREE TIMES more than I did A,K. I had less A,A Q,Q and J,J then I should have, but had kings more than I should.

Also, the number of times I HIT anythin on the flop was 1 in every 4.02 times. Which is far worse than I should have.

I welcome anyone with a good number of records to tell us what you found. Thanks.

trex7777 07-31-07 10:11 PM

I have read all the posts on this page and I too, maybe the biggest sucker of them all. But Karrotsticks going my blood boiling. Not because he is completely wrong, but partially. Firstly, let me say that I am in full agreement that anyone who says the play money tables are rigged should be taken behind the barn and shot. You'd have to be an idiot to think that. That being said, I just started playing online 2 weeks ago for money. I have been playing poker at casinos for the past two years. By no means am I a pro, but I'm a pretty good player. I've made some money. (Again, I play 1-2 NL and usually win a few hundred bucks if I bring a few hundred). I CANNOT TELL YOU HOW MANY TIMES FTP has screwed me over on bad beats. Like others on this page stated, it's almost as if without a locked up Ace high flush with no chance for anyone to beat you, you EXPECT that the system will give you a bad beat. I have lost over $3000 in the past two weeks. Indeed I have become an addict and probably need help, but that is besides the point. I don't play wrecklessly. My theory is that some players are FTP plants and they can possibly see the cards or they play with the house's money. I've been beat almost every time I get pocket AA with a river card. No matter what, everytime I go all in, even with the best hand by far, I lose. EVERYTIME! It simply cannot be the case to have the kind of results that have occurred over and over again. Tonight, after dropping another $300, I vowed to myself never to play on that site again. If Amazon.com can track what other types of music you might be interested in based on previous things you have browsed for, my guess is the FTP knows when they have a sucker and rigs the cards to suck that person dry especially if they know that person will continue to dump money in. My advise to everyone I can share this information with is to STAY AWAY from FTP unless you want to play 10 cent poker and are ok with losing $50 over a weeks time or so or winning a few bucks, but there is absolutely no question in my mind that your chances of losing money on FTP are much greater than doing so playing in a casino....(and it has very little to do with reading people's body language at the level that I play at)

whatsgood 08-01-07 02:33 PM

I found this forum/site by searching for "full tilt rigged" in my search engine. So as you have probably guessed I've been burned by Full Tilt in a suspicious way more than once. There are some things I wanted to bring up. On one hand, there are some of you that complain about going all in preflop with a premium pocket pair and losing to a higher pair very often. At the same time, the same person complains about going in with a higher pocket pair against a lower pair and losing to a set. While I've seen my share of both on this site, making both of these arguments in the same breath does not make sense to me. Also, people compare playing multiple tables (or even one table) online to playing live games. Live games move significantly slower than even 1 online table, which means you will see a larger number of hands and of course an increased number of bad beats or improbable combinations. I have probably played over a million hands of online poker on multiple sites over the last few years. There is no cardroom player that can make a similar claim in their lifetime without playing online. So as much as they think they've seen, their sample is not really relevant. On the other hand, I've suffered a lot on this site due to bad beats and am too scared to go all in with the nuts on the flop because I have a feeling my opponent will improve to beat me on the turn and river. This is the feeling that brought me to reading this forum. I play mostly $2/$4, but also have a scale of limits according to my bankroll - so I do drop down to lower limits. I have tried all limits below 2/4 out of curiousity for a period of time as well. There is an alarming number of bad beats that happen on this site, where your opponents happen to his improbably draws to beat you. I've tested this with really small limits .05/.10 to .25/.5 by playing recklessly hoping for underpairs to turn sets and for improbable gutshot draws or runner runner flushes to hit. Although I was not turning a profit this way, I was able to stay alive for a pretty long time. The way it worked is, I would consistently lose pot after pot until I hit a huge improbably draw and took a huge pot, winning back most of my bankroll (in each case with my opponent complaining about how rigged the site is). What I learned is, there is likely no bots or players on the inside. However, I think there is something wrong with the card generator. I notice it because I feel a difference from all of the other sites (and I'm not saying the others are fully honest). The problem I have is that I am torn between and I try to prove and disprove this theory all of the time. Some of the crazy stories however, can really be explained by chance. One of my early home cash games, I flopped a pair with 52o on a 972 flop. I was bet into from early position and bluff-raised, I was put all in and called the bet against a friend of mine who flipped over 99. I then caught 2 on turn and last 2 on river to beat him. Two hands later I caught a Royal Flush - which is unheard of in a home cash game! Two weeks ago I hit 4 of 6 lottery numbers twice in one week. You can get a calculator and count the odds, but sometimes things happen. I would really be interested in comparing Full Tilt's poker tracker stats to those of other sites to see if there is variation in frequency of the different events in question.

un666 08-02-07 05:16 PM

yes the playchip tables are RIGGED because its the same software AS THE REAL MONEY. I can sum up fulltilt poker in one sentence THE WORST HAND ALWAYS WINS. I used to play for real money and got tired of losing my hard earned money with the best hand to donks everyday so i recently started playing for playchips and nothing changed. example just 10 min ago i went all in with a-q vs some donk who called with q-9. preflop im going to win 7 out of 10 time because im a 70% fav preflop. long story short the flop hits nether of us the turn same thing only one card to come the river im a 95% fav to be exact and what a surprise he hits a 9 on the river. hahahahah this gay ass site is so rigged its not funny. And when i say rigged here's what i mean. Anyone who thins a guy is sitting there looking to screw you is wrong. whoever desighed there software made it so losing hands will draw more then winning hands so donks will keep coming back. let me end by saying this anyone who thinks im wrong please try this out i did and it is very convincing. go play some platchip table and purposely go all in with shit hands 7-2 3-6 j-4 and so on any hand that you know is garbage and i guarantee you will win more hands then you will believe ive done it several times and it is sad tom watch a-a lose to your 4-2 offsuit. IF YOU THINK IM BLUFFING TRY IT ON PLAYCHIPS YOU WILL WIN WHEN YOU SHOULD'NT MANY TIMES OVER.

jaywepp 08-06-07 02:58 PM

I'm a little torn when it comes to this. I started with $50.00 on FullTilt about 3 months ago and have turned it into $900. So while I have had success on the site (mostly play $10.00 $20.00 Sit and Gos), I would be lying if I said there wasn't some degree of "rigging" on the site.

Sure, you play about 5 times the amount of hands in any hour then you would if you played at a casino. However, even with that said, I think I see more then 5 times the amount of bad beats in any given hour.

Take last weekend for an example... I had Ace King 15 times in 2 days. I won exactly twice with that hand the entire weekend and one of those times I pushed my opponent out early with my betting. Who knows what they would hae caught if I let them get past the flop!

However, while I do think the card/number generator at FullTilt is a little screwey, the one thing we should all keep in mind is there is no such thing as a random number generator. Patters will always develop! To be honest it would be impossible for FullTilt or any of the other poker sites to comit the fraud of rigging the site for the same reason it is pretty much impossible to pull any such large level fraud, there are too many people who would need to be involved. The truth would come out somewhere and the company would be exposed. Especially what has to be a billion dollar entity like fulltilt.

Again, I don't trust the site completely and have had my share of times where i questioned what happened, but overall, it's a pretty safe site. I guess the one thing I would advise players to do when it comes to online poker is don't try to "walk the dog" or slowplay strong hands. Save that for the Dominant a miracle would have to happen after the flop (2 outer or less) for you to lose. Don't know about you, but i'll flop 3 pair and every darn time I have a flush draw staring me straight in the face=)

jaywepp 08-10-07 10:52 AM

Okay.. this has me on "Tilt" so to speak. I might be coming over to your guys side...

Was playing in a $10.00 $15K guarantee rebuy last night. I didn't realize it was a rebuy until I got in. I say that because I hate rebuys and don't waste my time with em because of the blind luck needed just to survive the first break most of the time.

So... Not only do I manage to survive, but I do pretty well and have around 8K at the break, which was about middle of the road. We keep going after the break for awhile and I get ACE QUEEN Off. I raise it to 1000 pre flop and get one caller. Flop comes something like Ten Nine Four... Guy checks in front of me so I take a chance and go all in for about 6K, he calls and we turn over cards... he has Jack SEVEN! I hit my queen on the turn and am feeling pretty good.. well of course an eight pops on the river to give him a straight.

The guy did have around 20K in chips to start the hand, but that probably didn't even put him ine top 20 at this point in the tourney. In what world would you call the pre-flop raise, let alone calling a 6K raise when you had nothing more then a gutshot straight draw.

So who knows anymore. I'll just keep plugging along.

mrkromer 08-11-07 05:16 PM

I wish everyone would quit bitching on here about someone taking a chance on a gutshot straight for $10!!!

This isn't the same game that pros play! Of course people make different choices when there's a substantial amount of money on the line; there's just not many people that are affected by losing $10.

Enjoy poker everyone; quit complaining about other people's decisions.

nathanthomp 09-17-07 08:41 PM

This site is a motherƒucking joke. I had J5 flop comes J52 I check, his dumbåss goes all in he has AA. TURN IS THE GODDDAMN ACE!!!1 1 FUÇKIN OUTER ARE YOU FUÇKIN KIDDING ME. OF course I dont hit the 5 and lose. This site can suck my 8" CøCK and swallow a load of my jizz. all the ƒuckin çunts on this site cheat and steal your money. IF YOU DEPOSIT YOU WILL LOSE GUARANTEED. I deposited $100 and sat at $1/$2. I have Ad Kd raise to $10, one call. Flop is 6d 8d Jd. I go all in, he calls with 8s 8c. GUESS WHAT THE RIVER WAS?? THE 8!! BULL§HIT!! One outers every fµcking hand. All these ßitches can blow my fat Diçk. If I saw them in real life I would beat the fµçking shi* out of their fuçkin åss. The owner of the site is a puss¥ for not meeting me face to face... if he did i would shove my çock in his åss. Fµck FullShἱtPoker.

uberfilth 09-25-07 05:27 PM

Wow Nathan, you must be the most stupid person I've ever seen. Where do I even start?
For a start I was curious as to why you were playing J5 in the first place. I'm guessing the pot was raised with aces, but I could be wrong, so I'll leave that and assume you were in the big blind, or are an idiot...
So the flop comes and makes your 2 pair, and you slowplay, fair enough, although the 5 could easily be counterfeited on a later street. So the "dumbass" goes all in with aces. Hardly a terrible play, given the nature of the flop - he can't be expecting clowns to be playing trash like J5. Anyway, I digress. So he turns an ace, thus proving that the site is rigged against you, with his one outer. However, I've just checked a standard pack of cards - DEAR LORD! THERE'S 4 ACES IN THERE!! Weird. Ok, so I'm being picky - he had a 2 outer. But wait... Another 2 would in fact have you beaten (I'll give you some time to think about that). So he's really got a 5 outer. Still, you're right - you're still the favourite. However, let's think about it for a minute. Forget the 2, what are the odds of him hitting the ace? You've got 2 cards, he's got 2 cards, there's 3 on the board. So there's 45 cards left in the deck, and only 2 aces. So... back to school. What are the odds of hitting that? I'm going to take a stab at 1 in 22.5. So, once in every 23 hands or so, you should expect to see that ace. Consider how many hands you play. That's going to happen a lot. He could also hit it on the river, so it's twice as likely to happen - nearly one in ten. People win the (uk) lottery at odds of nearly 14 million to one - one in ten is pretty likely to happen, huh? Anyway, I've rambled enough. The actual odds of him beating you (by the river) are about 27%. Just over 1 in 4. Hardly conclusive proof the site is rigged, is it. So back to the post. He made his ace on the turn. Like you say, it's just a shame you didn't make your 5 on the river to beat him (another 2 outer, by the way) with you full house. Oh wait... you'd have 5s full of jacks. Last time I checked, that loses to Aces full of 5s. Idiot.

The other hand you don't really give us enough information - the board must have paired on the turn, otherwise his three 8s couldn't beat your nut flush. Anyway, how much of your $100 did you have left by then? He might have been going up against you with you only having $50 left - pretty short in the $2 games. Maybe the reason you lost all your money is because you put in $100 - HALF a buyin on the $2 tables, and were the victim of a little bit of variance. Even the pros (who, of course, have this site rigged for them) could easily lose $100 on the $2 tables before turning a profit. Try reading about bankroll management somewhere, if you can read.

Then you descend into your homoerotic fantasies, which I can't criticise at all - good for you, stand up for what you believe in. Homosexual rape. You truly are a credit to the human race.

crazy8slol 10-23-07 11:53 PM

I decided today to stop playing full tilt. I've been playing for 6 months there and lost 2k. The first 1k is understandable, I was playing bad, I overvalued top pair, etc. The second 1k is what has me concerned with online poker. I read a lot of poker books, I tightened up my game, I only play good cards, etc. Until recently I've agreed with "Online poker isn't rigged, you just play more hands so you see more bad beats." But while that's true, if you consistently put your money in with the best of it, you should consistently win. Aces v Kings, King hits way more than it should. Flush beaten by runner runner full house. While I also acknowledge that the bad beats stand out more than the winning hands, I'm still being beaten way more than I should while holding the best hand before the river. I love playing poker. I love playing poker online. BUT, I can't keep playing online for the same reason you wouldn't play against someone dealing off the bottom of the deck. The beats are nuts and I'll have to go back to driving to Atlantic City if I want to play poker.

I'm reminded by something Mike Matusow said: "When I play poker live, I have maybe one losing month out of 15. When I play online, I'm lucky to have 4 good days a month."

Hoomey 11-02-07 09:24 PM

WHY Are plattforms rigged ? I tell you...Interesting conversations round here.. the posts here DENYING that online poker is rigged always claim that there wont be any advantage for the platforms riggin the cards... well.. bringt it to the point and think about that : after gettin f*+++* 1,5 years online(1 year titan poker... the WORST EVER and now full tilt.. good bye as well..) I can definitely tell some patters : Small stack : (especially tournaments etc.):
LOSE ..whatever good cards you might have most of the time

-> WHY ?: Game should be over as quickly as possible to start a new one -> another rake for the platform (server capacity are surely not enough for INFINITE tables)

Next pattern: If Bankroll gets smaller and smaller (there seems to be some magicall border) -> lose,lose and lose till youre broke.. WHY: basic psychology.. most people are then "tilt" and think "o.k, NOW i win my money back" and wire money again and again because I WANNA BE A PRO AS WELL CANT BE THAT HARD ?!!??..yeah right..

so much about the point "why should the cards be rigged-- no advantage for the plattforms??" .. really ? think about it.. I put my whole energy rather in live tables ;)

LexusLS430ultra 11-07-07 02:13 PM

I've seen an incredible number of suck-outs on FTP which really makes me question if it is a fair game. After they caught cheating at AbsolutePoker.Net (google it) I began to wonder about FTP. I've been keeping track of the improbable suckouts, their frequency, and the situation surrounding the hands, and it comes down to 2 cases:

1-Player knows what all the cards on the table are; or 2-Player knows what cards are coming out next.

#1 is possible by using various programs to intercept network packets & then display them in a separate window (not too different from a network sniffer).

#2 is easier, by using a predictive shuffling algorithm (you obviously have to know which algorithm they use, but at that point, it only requires that you get to the same point in the shuffle, which you can figure out within a few hands, then you will know what the next draw card is in the predictive shuffler). All a deck is - is an array that get's "shuffled" by using a random number generator to either exchange 2 cards in the deck, or use the RAND to select which cards to copy into the "live deck". So this isn't difficult, you just have to know which RAND function they use to shuffle, and you can know everybody's cards forever.

Cheating on line, it is happening. Don't play at all as it is too easy for them to rip you off.

Even worse, it would be trivial for the website owner to set up a few "bots" that could take advantage of this information and steal you blind, and you'd never even know it. Stay away from on-line poker sites. Learn from my mistake. Play them for free, but don't ever use real money.

LexusLS430ultra 11-07-07 02:18 PM

Talk to everybody you know that has ever played FTP and find out if ANYBODY has EVER taken a profit out of FTP. Sure some of us play bad (though I HAVE won WSOP super-satellites in the past, and made it very deep into WSOP and WPT tournaments in Atlantic City, so I'd like to think I have some clue what is going on), but see if anybody ever knows ANYbody who has made any money (and taken it out of FTP). That may be a big clue. If NOBODY is winning, then it makes things much more suspicious.

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